many for in Time, instead of being fuffered to run on for Years together, till un infupportable Debt is contracted,. without any other Notice taken of the Reafon of its Growth, than the laying annually a general State of the Debt on-the Table of the Houfe of Commons. This we conceive to have been the Cafe ;and, if it be, do not err,, we think, in affirming, that had the Services appeared to have been neceffary, yet this Manner of increafing the Debt would not have been warranted. 4thly, Neither can we apprehend, how the Safety of the Kingdom depended upon thofe extraordinary Services, fome of which were performed in the Mediterranean, others in the Baltick, against Powers not at Enmity with Great Britain, whofe Friendship (it seems to us) we should rather have cultivated, and whofe Refentments we had, and still have (we fear) Reason to ap prehend: We cannot but think it the true Interest of Great-Britain to intermeddle as little as is poffible in the Quarrels of Europe; and then, by our good Offices chiefly, without declaring any Refolution to fupport our Mediation by Force, or making ourselves either Principals or Parties in Wars that do not immediately concern us. We look upon our Navy (the natural Security of our Ifland) as too much hazarded, and fome chief Branches of our Trade as highly endanger'd, by the Confequences of thofe remote Expeditions, nor are we yet fatisfied, that the Peace by us mediated and concluded in the North. hath not made the Provifion of Naval Stores for our Fleet more precarious than formerly, tho' on that fingleArticle the Safety of the Kingdom may poffibly.depend';: nor can we judge the present Tranquillity likely to last, fince, after all our Expence, the late Northern Peace hath reduced Sweden so low, and left the Czar in the Poffeffion of fuch Provinces as may render him very formidable; and what Matters may ftill remain unad jufted in Treaties, whereby the Tranquillity may foon be difturbed, we cannot determine, fince we have not been indulged.in our Defire of infpecting thofe Treaties.. W. Ebor', Scarsdale, Trevor, Briftol, Strafford, Fr. Roffen', Uxbridge,, Gower, Coruper, Fran. Cefriens, Guilford, L St. John de Bletfoe, Bathurst, Compton, Bingley. Then the other Refolution being likewife read a fecond Time, The Queftion was put, whether to agree with the Committee in the faid Refolution? It was refolved in the Affirmative. Diffentient' ft, Becaufe that Part of the Queftion which concerns fuch of his Majefty's Ships as are faid, but not proved, to have been neceffarily kept out the whole Year has not the least Relation, as we conceive, to any thing that has been yet objected to, which was, the not paying Ships that came home before the Winter, and ought by the ancient Usage of the Navy to have been paid off; and therefore we cannot but think was very improperly made Part of the Queftion. 2dly, Because it being admitted in the Question, that the ancient Ufage of the Navy was, that all Ships, 'when they returned home from their feveral Voyages, fhould not be kept in Pay during the Winter (as was the Cafe of the late Baltick Squadrons for fome Years paft) and it not having been made appear, as we think, in a parliamentary Way, that by any Treaty with Sweden it was neceffary to fend Ships fooner in any Year than might have been confiftent with the faid ancient Usage; we are of Opinion, that the Refolution will encourage the Practice complained of, and will greatly contribute to make Fleets (fo much to the Honour and Security of this Kingdom) too chargeable to be fupported. 3dly, Becaufe we cannot but be surprised, there should be the leaft Doubt (as in the Question) whether any Money might have have been faved by paying off the Men, when it appears by a Paper upon the Table, that feveral Ships Companies, amounting to many thousands of Men, have been kept in Pay during the Winter; which Expence, we cannot but think, ought to have been avoided, it appearing from other Papers and Reprefentations upon the Table, that by paying the Men off, more than five Parts in fix of the whole Charge of those Men during the Winter had been faved to the Publick. 4thly, Because a Refolution of this Houfe, that feems to 233 to countenance a Practice of this Sort (at a Time when every way of getting Money at the Expence of the Publick is not found to be lefs in Peoples Thoughts than formerly) may probably encourage thofe who fhall have Opportunity in future Times too readily to contribute towards the Increafe of Navy-Debts, though they are attended with fo many ill Confequences, that his Majefty, in a moft gracious Speech from the Throne, has very lately been pleafed to fay, they do not only affect all publick Credit, but greatly increase the Charge and Expence of the Current Service, and are of all others the most heavy and burthenfome. W. Ebor', Strafford, Guilford, Cowper, Boyle, Aberdeen, Scarfdale, Gower, St. John de Bletfoe, Weston, Foley. Bathurst, Fran. Ceftriens'," Aylesford, North and Grey, Brifol, Trevor, Die Jovis 1° Februarii, 1721. The Houfe having been in a Committee to take into further Confideration the Caufes of contracting fo large a Navy Debt, And being refumed, and Monday Fortnight appointed to take that Matter into further Confideration. A Motion was made, that the Victualling his Majesty's Ships by any other than the Victuallers appointed for that Service, or their Agents, is contrary to the Course of the Navy, and by taking away the proper Checks, is one Caufe of contracting fo large a Navy-Debt.. And the Question being put thereupon?, It was refolved in the Negative. Diffentient' ft, Because it being unquestionably the ancient Courfe of the Navy to victual all his Majefty's Ships by the Commiffioners of the Victualling or their Agents, unless in Cafe of Neceffity; and it appearing to us, by a Paper returned before this Houfe from the Victualling-Office, that many Ships and Squadrons of Ships have of late Years been victualled by the Commanders, very few of which were fo victualled by any Order, and amongst those many Instances a few only were excufed, because there were were no Agents for the Victualling-Office, nor any Stores in the Places where the Ships then were; we think it reasonable to conclude that all the feveral Victuallings in the faid Paper contained, being much the greater Number, which were neither excused therein nor faid to be ordered, were fo provided without any Order or Excufe whatfoever; and confequently were a needlefs Breach of the faid good Courfe of the Navy, and by taking away the proper Check made to fave the Publick-Money must, in our Opinion, neceffarily have been one of the Occafions of the Increase of the Navy-Debt. 2dly, We cannot but obferve, that if the faid Excufe had (in the Paper abovementioned) been applied to all the feveral Inftances there of Victualling, in a Manner contrary to the Course of the Navy, yet it had been infufficient, fince it is not alledged that Agents for the Victualling and Stores might not have been timely had in the Places where the Ships were victualled, if due Notice had been given to the Commiffioners of the Victualling, and proper Precautions and Endeavours had been ufed to that End. 3dly, We cannot but think, that carrying this Question in the Negative will undoubtedly encourage this Breach of the Course of the Navy, as it is acknowledged to be, and in confequence put it into the Power of every Ad miral or Commander in Chief of any Squadron, and every Commander of a particular Ship, not only to furnifh fuch Provifions, both in Quantity and Quality, as they shall think fit, but by letting the Men go on Shore, when in Port, on Pretence of fupplying Provifions, leave a Charge on the Publick for want of the proper Check, though to the Detriment of the Sea Service. 4thly, Becaufe by this Leave given to the Comman ders on the Head of Victualling, they have it in their Power (thro' the Want of the faid true and ancient Check) to bring a very great Charge upon the Head of Wages, which muft undoubtedly, as we apprehend, occafion a great Waste of the publick Treasure, and confequently an Increase of the Navy-Debt. 5thly, Because, we think, that to fuppofe the Commander of any Squadron or Ship will not, when it is fe entirely in his Power, do what shall be for his Intereft, is to believe him lefs inclined to his Intereft than the Generality of his Fellow Subjects on Shore. 6thly, Because, we believe, if this Houle will not difcourage taking away proper Checks till Proof had (as arged in the Debate) of what had been got by Individuals for Want of those Checks, the Delay and Diffi culties attending fuch an Inquiry will probably hinder any Difcouragement being given to fuch Practices, which are allowed to be contrary to the ftarding Inftructions to the Commiffioners of the Victualling and to the Commanders of his Majesty's Ships. W. Ebor', Scarsdale, North and Grey, Trevor, Compton, Strafford, Boyle, Craven, St. John de Bletfoe, Guilford, Bathurst, Bingley, Litchfield, Aylesford. Bristol, Die Sabbati 3° Februarii, 1721. The Lord Chancellor coming late to the House, and not having fent to the Lord Chief Juftice King, whom his Majesty, by Letters Patent under the Great Seal, enter'd in the Journal, had authorized to fupply the Place of the Lord Chancellor in the Houfe, in his Lordship's Abfence, and obferving fome Uneafinefs amongst the Lords, acquainted the Houfe, that he having been fummoned to attend his Majefty at St. James's, had accordingly waited upon his Majefty there, where he was detained longer than he could forefee, by his Majesty's Command, and that as foon as he was at Liberty he came hither with the utmost Expedition, and asked Pardon for his Stay of the Lords, who had been fo long kept in Expectation of him. Contents 31 Clock? A Motion was made to adjourn, and the Queftion being put, whether this Houfe fhall be now adjourned till Monday Morning next Eleven a It was refolved in the Negative. Diffentient' ft, Because the Houfe ftanding adjourned to this Day at Eleven a-Clock, and a great Number of Lords |